Religious debate! GOOGOGOGOGOOGO

Pffft. Dude, this is a terrible debate. All points have already been made, and this is just gonna end up being a stupid arguement with people pissing each other off and nothing being settled. People won't give up their beliefs because of anything said in an online debate forum.
That being said, I am personally a Pastafarian.

Jesus is teh gey.

Jesus is teh gey.
God and jesus is bullshit.

You guys make baby Jesus cry.
=*(

lol...

Praise Allah

I don't really get why people feel the need to hate Christians and degrade them every chance they get but whatever.

A Jehovah's Witness came to our house today. He was very nice...

I think we should all just be tolerant of every one elses beliefs, without trying to force our own on anyone else. Seriously, the whole door to door thing and pamphlets being handed out at corners, and trying to get creationism taught in schools stuff pisses me off. But other than that, live and let live.

In that case we should let them do what they want too. It's hypocritical to limit "live and let live" to only those whom we completely agree with.

Well, if you had read my post I specifically said, other than that, live and let live. Thus excluding such actions from my statement. Furthermore, they should let me live without their disturbances. And in the case of people trying to get creationism taught in schools, have you ever heard of the seperation between church and state? Its part of the constitution, making it illegal to mix church and state, i.e. teaching creatonism in schools.

I don't see why it would be unconstitutional to teach all the different points of creationism, and all religion for that matter, in schools. If they taught us the finer points of all the major religions in schools then this world would be a much better place.

And in the case of people trying to get creationism taught in schools, have you ever heard of the separation between church and state?
I wish I could come up with such original arguments... :(

Here's a more original argument:

God sucks christians suck creationists suck darwins 1337 I pwn jall.

Shhhhh. Don't say it so loudly! You're likely to be hit by stray lightning!

Yeah I agree that Darwinism is correct and all that. And I think anyone who believes otherwise is obviously part of a brainwashing cult who preys on the weak minded and feeble. However if they want to be stupid and stick with their beliefs, than that is their choice. I just want their choices to be kept away from me, i.e. out of schools. Again, refer to the constitution, seperation of church and state.

Dude creationism has nothing to do with the "church" or "state." Evolution is a part of science and so is creationism, and it would be a bigger injustice to ban one way of thinking just because it's not as widely accepted. There is a difference between learning information and being forced to believe it, and nobody is forcing you to believe creationism or believe prepositions or believe the law of gravity. The fact that some people might choose to believe creationism might seem illogical to you, but I think we still need to give people the choice.

Yeah I agree that Darwinism is correct and all that. And I think anyone who believes otherwise is obviously part of a brainwashing cult who preys on the weak minded and feeble.
So what would you call your beliefs? All you're doing is choosing to believe the word of someone that you can wrap your brain around as logical, just like EVERYONE else. And if they don't agree with you, then there's obviously something wrong with them, I mean... there's just so much more fulfillment in your life than everyone else's right?

Or at least those "God" people... more specifically the Christian people; why is it that everyone hates Christians so much anyway? It's not like Christians and Roman Catholics are the only group of people in history, or even NOW, who have ever enslaved or overrulled nations, or slaughtered innocent people in the name of their God (or lack thereof). There are screwed up people in every denominational group... Atheists aren't necessarily the nicest people in the world.

Your mind set about this seems no better than the Wesbro Baptist church as far as I'm concerned. And don't even try to combat that with "wat no leik omfg its not leik i wak around wit signs sayin 'god hates fags' nd 'thank god for 9/11'! wtf r u talkin about!?!?!?11? not 2 mmenchin teh fact dat dey r teh ANTI-SEMITZ nd i r jewish hwo DRAE u compeir me 2 dem!!! :mad: :mad: :mad:" Duh, I KNOW this. I didn't say you do the same crap they do, so we might as well not even start that argument.

All I am saying is that it just seems, from the way you present yourself, that you are intolerant of anyone who is open and verbal about beliefs that are opposed to yours. Though at the same time you expect ALL THOSE people to shut up and have to take in everything that goes completely against what they believe. What kind of a screwed up world vision is that? All that leads to is riots breaking out and marches full of people demanding their right to free speech.

I am so tired of being labeled as "brainwashed" when the people who do the labeling are just as brainwashed as us. Just about different things. I mean, the only reason people believe what they believe is because it brings them relief in some way. Weather it be God, or Satan (furr realz), or Psi Energy or... whatever. Respect the fact that people are just trying to be happy. I mean... if they do messed-up crap like kidnap people's babies and offer it up as a a bloddy sacrifice to the Almighty Zorthemeteus or whatever... then feel free to beat the living daylights out of them, but seriously, teaching creationism to children won't do anything.

Besides, the fact that you're so adamant about them NOT learning about it means you want them to remain ignorant and thus it becoming easier for them to not believe in God. Seems kinda manipulative to me...

I had a really long answer to this, but then my computer crapped out, and I am not gonna write the whole thing out again. So basically this is what it boils down to. I don't give a shit if you are religious, I have no problem with that, if it helps make you happy then more power to ya. But creationsim ain't science. So keep your religion out of the public school system. Its the law. And stop typing with all the "lieks" and "tehs" and "draes" it just makes you sound stupid. Go ahead and use them when you are joking around, but when you are attempting to be serious, don't. It only further invalidates your pathetic attempt at a point.

Praise Allah

I had a really long answer to this, but then my computer crapped out, and I am not gonna write the whole thing out again. So basically this is what it boils down to. I don't give a shit if you are religious, I have no problem with that, if it helps make you happy then more power to ya. But creationsim ain't science. So keep your religion out of the public school system. Its the law. And stop typing with all the "lieks" and "tehs" and "draes" it just makes you sound stupid. Go ahead and use them when you are joking around, but when you are attempting to be serious, don't. It only further invalidates your pathetic attempt at a point.
It's funny that one belief is allowed in school, and no others.

Creationism by itself has nothing to do with "religion"

Dude! It is not one "belief" over another. It is Darwinism - a fact based scientific theory over a religious idea of how the world started. The law prohibits creationism being taught in school. And seriously its science class, not religious ideas class.

I might as well point it out that Evolution has never been proven as 100% fact. So yes, it IS, a belief.And stop typing with all the "lieks" and "tehs" and "draes" it just makes you sound stupid. Go ahead and use them when you are joking around, but when you are attempting to be serious, don't. It only further invalidates your pathetic attempt at a point.
I wasn't trying to be serious...

Seperation between church and state does not mean seperation between church and the rest of the world. It means the government doesn't affiliate itself with any particular religion. And creationism doesn't affiliate itself with any particular religion either. The simple possibility of a higher power does not constitute religion.

Technically religion is simply acting on what you believe. Not learning about other's beliefs. Trying to keep children from learning about other types of people aside from your own, in a non-negative manner, is cowardly. You're basically admitting that you're afraid that they'll become "one of them".

Dude! It is not one "belief" over another. It is Darwinism - a fact based scientific theory over a religious idea of how the world started. The law prohibits creationism being taught in school. And seriously its science class, not religious ideas class.
Even though I'm not a Christian, and I don't believe in God, I do believe in other's rights to believe what they want. Truthfully, all religions should be taught more in public schools. You'd be amazed what you could learn from a different culture.

We need to teach religion, not encourage it. Or, more accurately, we should not encourage believing in any one religion. People need to be more open to the ideas and beliefs of the rest of the world. That will solve a lot of problems.

Ok, you guys are really starting to annoy me with your inability to listen. I have no problem with religion. If anyone wants to join one, if it makes anyone happy to be part of one, then I urge that person to go and be a part of their church, to take pride and joy in their religion. But stop calling it science. It should not be taught in classrooms. Nothing you can say will change my mind, and apparently nothing I can say will change yours. That is why, if you will refer to my first post, I originally stated this was a stupid debate that would never go anywhere.
And I actually do agree that religion should be taught in schools. In HISTORY class. Not SCIENCE. It is important for people to understand and be open to all ideas and beliefs. I just think they should be given in the correct context. Teaching a religion in science is just the incorrect context because it introduces it as a fact that is as equally valid as the theory of evolution, and that is infringing on the seperation of church and state. However when taught in History class it is just a necessary part of the worlds history and culture, no different than a war, or the rennaisance, and every bit as important. Its all about context. Now this whole thing has gotten as stupid and outta hand as I predicted so don't be suprised if I don't visit this thread again.

and with that i think we can all conclusively say... "."
( the "." means end of input {you know like in a sentence? [wow... brackets in brackets in brackets.... thats a new level of weird]})

No one is saying that religion = science. Maybe you're the one who isn't listening.

Or more accurately... "reading correctly". You seem to be taking our words and interpreting them however you want. Or as if you're being attacked in some way. The only one taking this thread out of hand is you, gabriel...

I'd like to point out the fact that evolution was made illegal in China because they consider it a religion. (It is against the law in China to have a religion)

Whoa...

O_O

Didn't know that.

I mean, I knew the religion part, but I didn't realize they considered Darwinism to be religious.

I'd like to point out the fact that evolution was made illegal in China because they consider it a religion. (It is against the law in China to have a religion)
Religion isn't illegal, it's just discouraged.

Burning down churches and executing their members... yea that's pretty discouraging.

There are still Buddhist temples in China lying around so I don't think they banned religion too much. I also read a book about an American's time in China and he used to go to this Catholic Church in China, so China didn't exactly make religion something illegal.

FACT: if you are a member of the Chinese communist party (almost like being democrat or republican), you cannot join a religion......
it is not illegal in any way. only immoral if you are a member of the Chinese communist party

It is immoral. Except the PR of China is more fascist-communist than socialist-communist, because they have a free market. That, and they discourage anyone from being different than everyone else.

Religion in China, as well as the one-child rule, is not really strictly enforced. There's the law, and there are people who enforce it, but most people who want to have a religion or have one more child just keep it on the DL and they're fine.

a second child in china is not killed, it simply does not get the government funding (health care etc) of the first child.......

I think they should teach about all religions from a neutral standpoint in school and let the kids decide for themselves.

That's a good idea, but it wouldn't work. Religion is more of a family matter, and if the parent follows one religion, the kid has no choice in the matter. I know that a few parents, at least around where I live, would flip and pull their kids out if they knew that the schools were teaching their kid anything other than what the parent has led their kid to believe their entire lives.

Not true. I'm atheist, despite my family's pedigree for being hardcore protestant.

I know people who are like that. They're the ones who always use yin-yang signs for their picture and debate in support of anarchy.xD

My mom was never raised religiously, with the exception of her mother, who has a lot of Jewish heritage but didn't actually practice the religion. My dad was raised strict private-school Catholic and hated it, so he never went to church a day of his life once he moved out. So both my parents are pretty nonreligious. I have a lot of beliefs and philosophies, but I don't practice any one religion.

The point is, most parents get really mad/annoyed/disappointed/totally appalled when their kids don't want to follow the same religion they did. In the modern world, it's much more common for kids to believe what they want, but before the '80s it was almost unheard of for kids to not follow the same religion as their parents.

hardcore protestant.
JESUS LOVES YOU MOTHERFUCKER!!!!!!

Deep down we all want our children to believe exactly what we believe... and it'd be stupid if we didn't.

JESUS LOVES YOU MOTHERFUCKER!!!!!!
.

Deep down we all want our children to believe exactly what we believe... and it'd be stupid if we didn't.
I disagree. Of some parents this is true. Of other parents...this is not so. To Christians, it is a sin to not be a Christian, and it is a sin to not devote your life to the Christian-izing of others. If you follow God, your kids had damn-well better follow God, too. If you're Taoist or Shinto, your kids can do whatever they damn-well please.

I don't want to sound like I'm pigeon-holing here, but to parents who are long-time Christians (usually mothers, I find), there are two types of people: Christians and non-Christians. Friend, and foe. Their child will not associate with any child who is not a Christian. There are many Christians who are open-minded, but this is what I find, around where I live.

jesusdressup.com

I disagree. Of some parents this is true. Of other parents...this is not so. To Christians, it is a sin to not be a Christian, and it is a sin to not devote your life to the Christian-izing of others. If you follow God, your kids had damn-well better follow God, too. If you're Taoist or Shinto, your kids can do whatever they damn-well please.
I don't want to sound like I'm pigeon-holing here, but to parents who are long-time Christians (usually mothers, I find), there are two types of people: Christians and non-Christians. Friend, and foe. Their child will not associate with any child who is not a Christian. There are many Christians who are open-minded, but this is what I find, around where I live.
Um... okay? Either way the parents would prefer it if their children followed the same path they did. No matter what they believe. And btw, not all Christian parents are like that (aka mine).

I'll shed an inkling of weakness here and tell you that a few months ago I was doubting my beliefs, and my mom didn't seem at all upset or frightened. All she tells me about this subject is that I have to make a choice, and whichever one I make she'll love me either way (well, basically... I'm not letting you in that much on my personal life :P).

Praise Allah

Um... okay? Either way the parents would prefer it if their children followed the same path they did. No matter what they believe. And btw, not all Christian parents are like that (aka mine).
I'll shed an inkling of weakness here and tell you that a few months ago I was doubting my beliefs, and my mom didn't seem at all upset or frightened. All she tells me about this subject is that I have to make a choice, and whichever one I make she'll love me either way (well, basically... I'm not letting you in that much on my personal life :P).
I'm well aware that that isn't how all Christian or otherwise religious parents are. This is just experience from around where I live, where there are a lot of very devout, conservative types. If my girlfriend, and this is similar with a number of her friends, were to tell her mother that she was even so much as doubting her beliefs her mother would flip and go into some sort of crisis. There are a lot of open minded people in this world, which is very good, but there are still a very large number of people who wish to restrict their children's education in the field of spirituality to naught but what they wish for their children to believe.

It sounds ridiculous in theory, but I see it a lot, and when I do, it doesn't seem so unreasonable. To a lot of beliefs, there is only one reasonable belief, and all others are unforgiveable nonsense. The parents obviously believe this, and do not want their children growing up being rejected by God or the other 'only reasonable spiritual force.'

You spread your feces all over my thread

I'd like to point out the fact that evolution was made illegal in China because they consider it a religion. (It is against the law in China to have a religion)
Then what the hell is Buddhism?!

You spread your feces all over my thread
How about you actually take the time to read posts longer than two sentences...

Then what the hell is Buddhism?!
First of all, religion is not illegal in China, only discouraged. Second of all, only about 35% of the Chinese population is actually religious. I think about 60% of the people who actually are religious in China are Buddhist. So about 20% of total Chinese are Buddhist, while 65% are nonreligious. That leaves 15% of China to be split among (in order of popularity) Taoism, Shintoism, Hinduism, Muslim, and Christianity.

...And satanism. :dev:
=====
P.S., my current avatar is the shinto yin/yang symbol, correct? like this...:yinyang:

How about you actually take the time to read posts longer than two sentences...
I stopped reading his posts when I noticed they were usually angst teen shit